Soy Protein fights belly fat??

Interesting post. What if u are lactose/bread intolerant? What is the solution for those people?

Good article Joel,

Yep, it really is pretty sad how many people fall for the “soy is healthy” myth when all the evidence in fact points the other direction. Here’s an article for anyone interested on from Joe Mercola, who is considered one of the leading health experts in the world called “Why Soy Can Damage Your Health”…

http://www.mercola.com/article/soy/index.htm

It speaks for itself, I don’t touch Soy foods anymore… as for the study this article refers to… my guess is that the people in the study who were regular soy drinkers generally ate healthier, exercised more and had healthier lifestyles which explains the lessened belly fat and reduced occurrence of cancer. A lot of yoga n pilates types drink this stuff, the type of people you’d expect to find at a juice bar having a wheatgrass shot, and more power to em’, all that stuff is great for you and I do yoga myself… it surprises me though that this “scientific” study mistaked correlation for causation like that… poor form.

@ dylan:
There are several options. Almond milk, rice milk, oatmilk. Now I live in Sweden so I don’t know about the main substitue for gluten intolerant people, but our gluten-free products main ingredient is ususally buckwheat

dylan wrote:

Interesting post. What if u are lactose/bread intolerant? What is the solution for those people?

And also – even for those who are not lactose intolerant, I’ve heard that cow milk is not good for adolts. What other sources of protein can be used (except the obvious meat, poultry, fish and eggs:-))

It strikes me that to the vegetarian lobby any criticism of soy is a heresy. There iis almost religious zeal to state benefits of soy whether real or imagined. Keep up the good work highlighting these lazy, populist and just wrong articles.

very nice work Joel .very useful
which magazines do you recommend to read ?

I don´t like meat particularly, so that´s how I discoreved soy ans soy products. On regular basis I eat fish and chicken my favorites, but sometimes I get really fed up and that´s where soy comes in. Are all soy producs qually bad? Or is there some that are better than others? What about soy milk? Soybeans? Soyprotein isolates? I am confused, is it that ALL and everyhing with soy is bad or are there some stuff you can eat anyway?????

A couple of years ago my wife and I decided to stop drinking milk after reading about the link with breast and prostate cancer… so we switched to ‘healthy’ soy milk… then I started reading from Joel, Mercola, and others that soy is bad and I’ve now just learned that it is also linked to break cancer!

Today we tried Almond milk, but it tastes too much like almonds (I love eating almonds but it apparently not drinking them!)… we also got Hazelnut milk but it’s sweetened with Agave syrup… I’ve seen Quinoa milk at the store also which we may also try… but I haven’t found Oat milk anywhere in Greece (where we live). Rice milk I would imagine is high in carbs so we should avoid when on diet, right? Anyone knows which is the best (and healthiest) option for people fighting belly-fat?

Cheers,
Harry

Joel,

Thanks for bringing it out there.
I Bought the Dutch version of Muscle and Fitness last week and one of the articles said that according to certain studies, you could lose fat by drinking 1,2 or maybey 3 or 4 beers with your meal…
First they stated some of the general benefits, around caridovascular health, and then the part about belly fat was next.
Probably in two months they will say the opposite is true.

Now I’m pro having a beer or glass of wine in teh weekend as part of my cheats, but fooling myself by making it a habbit and then hoping to lose fat is a more then just a stretch of the truth!

This is the first time I have been motivated to submit a comment to a – blog?Where do you guys get your information from? Sounds like the same reseach establishment that states their research proves that nutitional supplements are a waste of time & money.
Why, if soy is such a terrible & dangerous product, have two of the leanest and healthiest races on earth (Japanese & Chinese) used soy for hundreds of years with none of the serious life threatening effects you continually warn us of. If you are going to perpetuate this scaremongering, will you please explain this anomally so we can trust your advice. My wife (Asian) has used soy for most of her many years and has excellent health and a beautiful lean body.
Please explain.

Joel,

I’m a big fan of you, Mike, and Isabel, however opening this newsletter from you this morning definitely made me angry. Soy to help belly fat and prevent breast cancer….what a lie! I opened the link with the full intention of unsubscribing. My mom fought a long and hard battle with breast cancer, her second bout, and refusing to do chemo again, we did ALOT of research on alternative therapy and diet. She was given 6 weeks to live, and made it 3 years. Why? We removed SOY, refined sugar, and high fructose corn syrup from her diet. Doing that put her cancer in remission. All the research I did said to stay away from soy. Which I found to be very hard. Soy, in one form or another, is in literally everything. So thank you for putting the kabosh on that statement, and keeping my faith.

Thanks for the clarification. I had heard your version of this (duh from you and Isabelle) at Transformation Domination last January.

How do these magazines allow such bad information to be published. Isn’t thee a moral obligation for truth in print? Unfortunately if people see it written it is somehow believable or the truth.

Thanks for keeping it clear Joel.

Actually there are plenty of real and credible studies that show various elements of the “soy scare” are completely wrong and not fully researched. Of course, the author not listing the sources is no good from a reporting perspective regardless of your standpoint on the issue, but so is misinforming by posting sources that seem legitimate or relevant but actually aren’t. I encourage people to actually go out and read the REAL research on soy and on the estrogen you are getting from it.

I haven’t checked those sources Joel mentioned specifically, but a broad study on the effects of estrogen levels as they pertain to cancer could potentially not be nearly as relevant as studies of the exact type and potency of the estrogen that comes from soy and it’s effect on the body as it pertains to cancer. I’ve read about several of the latter type of study, and the results may surprise you soy haters out there.

Also, from a sports nutrition standpoint, Soy has some very important qualities and some of the worlds leading sports nutritionists and sports nutrition researchers recommend soy protein directly after an intense workout. Don’t be misinformed, by either side of the debate, go out and actually read this stuff for yourselves!

Now off to check out those references Joel listed.

Joel, wasn’t there a study presented at a recent ISSN convention on the health benefits of including Soy Protein in your post-workout shakes?

Also, that statement says “Estrogen-like” not estrogen. But your reaction is “…since when does Estrogen….” I’ve read results from studies that sound like they might be the same place she got her info. I’ll go try to dig them up if I have time later.

So right Joel! Good article. Lost 60 lbs with no soy, no cow dairy, no processed sugars, no breads! All yummy veggies, eggs, sheep cheese, fish and fruit. Had been told I was lactose Intolerant, but that was just a Candidas problem AND not enough enzymes and probiotics in the diet!! All handled and not intolerant. Organic kifer, cheese, cottage cheese all are assisting the continued weight loss! Broccoli and spinach are great protein sources Dylan, so is chlorella and other ” sea” veggies if you are into that sort of thing.
Keep the articles coming Joel!

What about soy protein isolates, to take for instance after work out? I just really, really don´t like the taste of whey protein, no matter how I try to mix it…

I have to agree with you, that many of the articles in health and fitness magazines today do not appear to have a sound scientific foundation or to have been well researched. I find a lot of magazines give contradictory information between issues.

These articles often have the phrase “research has proven” but there is never any citations given for this research.

I’m much more inclined to believe a well referenced post than a fitness magazine blurb.

Thank Joel.

Great point to raise awareness for the mainstream Joel…most peeps are clueless about soy and ALL the GMOs in our food out there….enjoying your posts. Keep em comin…

Hey Joel, as always a pleasure to read your blogs.

I was wondering, what about the Chinese? They sometimes use soy sauce in their food. Is the amount of estrogen in their meals enough to increase estrogen substantially? Can one counter the effects? With broccoli or the like maybe? I’m curious, since I love soy sauce (though I am not a fan of tofu).

The problem with these studies, I think, is that they deal mainly with isolated components of soy products, or with the highly processed version of soy (and that several of them were done on mice without ovaries– not on humans with ovaries). These versions of soy are what give soy a bad name. I do believe that moderate intake (3 servings or less) of soy can be healthy– and this would mean soy that is either sprouted, fermented, or in its whole form. There are many studies to back this up, such as:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20668305
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20181808
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17516859
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9270408
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18791919

(these are just a very few of them).

@ shira: For those who are lactose and gluten intolerant, and who also avoid soy due to allergies, intolerance, or preference, rice protein is well-tolerated. The problem is, most if it is like drinking ground chalk. I’m not sure if I can put this on Joel’s site (please delete if I’ve done so inappropriately) but I find excellent results with Sun Warrior rice protein. It is finely milled, raw, and fermented. Very easy to digest. If high quality whey is not an option, this is the ticket. Even my non-lactose intolerant folks will use a combo, if for no other reasons than the great taste and to stretch their dollar since I make them order organic grassfed whey or nothing at all. Sort of a stickler there, but that’s just me. Joel is right about the soy. Avoid it. I was a vegan when I was a fitness competitor. I single-handedly kept the soy industry in business. Oops.

I think Almond milk is pretty yummy and who needs bread anyway? There are rice alternatives to bread like products, come on that was simple.

Well done, Joel, for speaking out. Also good comments from everyone – thanks!
I think the theory was that meat products were all treated with stilbestrol and other hormones and that isoflavones were good oestrogen mimics?
I spent years on the soy/vegetarian delusion of health. Result: excessive suffering through low cholesterol and low fat lifestyle, constant weight problem, plagued by oestrogenic tumours and other female disorders, wondering why I was chronically tired. Why? – medical advice and life time dairy insensitivity (amongst many other things, including wheat).
Result: dysfunctional low thyroid, hormonal disorders, strung out nervous system, type 2 diabetic.
Now: on the mend, restoring endocrine, hormonal and nervous system and back into training. Eating sensibly, all organic, including butter & cream, raw oils, meat, fish and anything that gives me energy. If I eat something that makes me tired I know to avoid it generally.
Strange thing I discovered that if I have unpasteurised & unhomogenised organic dairy plus regular probiotics (Lactobacillus) I don’t have problems with dairy at all. Have been advised to keep dairy to a minimum due to thyroid & have regular iodine drops (sensible for anyone in Australia).
I avoid all wheat and rice, most grains and eat fruit rarely as a treat. (Works for my metabolism). Lots of raw salad, sprouts, herbs – mostly home grown. No raw soy products whatsoever!
Fat loss: 20kgs and still going… increasing muscle as I go helps a lot with maintaining this.
Strength: Can leg press 200kgs 23 reps (to fatigue) comfortably
Mood: happy, energetic, active, positive
Diabetes: moving out of danger zone – now maintained by diet and exercise
Oestrogenic tumours: shrinking! (Naturopath recommend “Energetic Nutrition” site for good information on oestrogen related disorders)
Age: 54
:-)

Not to mention if there are pesticides and it’s not organic.
Like the scholarly citations!!!

Here is an article from Dr Marilyn Glenville PhD – one of England’s top Nutritionists – about using Soya as a natural healthy alternative to Hormone Replacement Treatment during Menopause.

The New Natural Alternatives to HRT

The menopause is not an illness. If you subscribe to the standpoint currently held by the conventional medical profession, you’d be forgiven for thinking it was. Women in many other cultures do not experience the menopause as a crisis demanding medical intervention. Many of them simply do not suffer the physical and emotional symptoms that women in the West are programmed to accept as inevitable. In our society the focus of the menopause is one of loss. Women are programmed to dwell on loss – the loss of periods, the loss of the ability to create life, the loss of hormones, the problems of the ‘empty-nest’ syndrome. In other societies, this time in a woman’s life is seen as one of gain, a time of great wisdom. A time when the emphasis shifts away from doing the chores, working in the fields, to the role of lawmaker and counsellor to younger couples, where maturity and experience make a significant and valuable contribution to the family and society.

What happens at the menopause?

At the menopause women literally run out of eggs. Each woman has a supply of eggs (approximately 2 million) from the moment she is born and over the years they are used up and die off. She finally reaches a certain age when there simply aren’t any more. What the body does then to try to get that woman to ovulate is to release the hormone FSH. This hormone is released every month in a normal cycle but during the menopause, a woman’s body registered that ovulation is not taking place, so even more FSH is pumped out.

The interesting thing is that as the ovaries decline their production of oestrogen, nature has something else up her sleeve. We are also able to produce a form of oestrogen (called oestrone) from our adrenal glands in order to compensate for the decline from the ovaries.

We also produce oestrogen from fat cells, so being ultra-slim will not have health benefits in the long run, particularly if you are going through menopause. Overweight isn’t the answer, either, but from an oestrogen-production point of view, you are better off being slightly overweight than slim.

Are there any symptoms?

These vary from woman to woman. Some women sail though the menopause without any symptoms and the only thing they notice is that their periods have stopped. Some of the women I have seen in my clinic report being completely drenched in sweat day and night, and getting up to change their night clothes two or three times a night, or even taking a shower in the middle of the night.

Symptoms of the menopause can include hot flushes, night sweats, vaginal dryness, mood swings, declining libido, osteoporosis, ageing skin, lack of energy, joint pains, weight gain, headaches and changes in hair quality. Interestingly, men also experience a lot of these symptoms, with irritability, a declining libido, changes in weight, ageing skin and hair, depression and anxiety. These symptoms are apparently part of the Western ageing process for both men and women, so it’s important not to blame every symptom that you experience on the menopause.
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What are your choices?

For the main symptoms of the menopause, such as hot flushes or vaginal dryness, you will be offered HRT. Unfortunately, if a women around the age of 45 goes to her doctor with any of these symptoms, it will immediately be put down to ‘hormones’, and you can guess what the first line of treatment will be. I have seen more women than I can count who have been put on HRT because of ‘hormone’ problems, only to find that they were not menopausal at all. There are a variety of other health conditions that throw up symptoms that are similar to those the menopause, so don’t assume – or, more importantly, let your doctor convince you – that there may not be another cause. What’s important is working out what symptoms are due to the menopause, and what are simply symptoms of ageing.

The natural treatment programme below aims to encourage optimum health, so that your body can manage this natural event with ease. In this section you will find a Plan of Action with a detailed summary of how you can plan your own treatment.

Dietary changes

A well-balanced diet is essential during the menopause as it enables the body to adjust automatically to the hormone changes, naturally maintaining oestrogen from the adrenal glands and fat deposits.

Phytoestrogens

One of the questions that most perplexes scientists is why and how the menopause is experienced so differently around the world. There are other cultures where women experience minimal and often no menopausal symptoms. Also linked to this issue is the fact that in some parts of the world, notably the Far East, breast cancer is not the major killer that it is here in the West. For example, the UK seems to have a breast cancer death rate that is about six times higher than that of women in Japan. The interesting thing is that as soon as Japanese women move to the West their breast cancer rate is the same.

As a result of this theory, scientists have begun to study the benefits of a group of plant hormones known as phytoestrogens. These hormones naturally occur in certain foods such as soya. Soya contains two flavonoids, genistein and daidzein, and studies have shown that they are chemically similar to Tamoxifen, which is the drug used to prevent a recurrence of breast cancer.

These very weak plant oestrogens latch on to the oestrogen receptors in the breast and they stop the more powerful carcinogenic oestrogens getting through. So they have a protective effect, as well as helping to balance hormones, which are responsible for menopausal symptoms such as hot flushes. Phytoestrogens have also been studied extensively for their effect on lowering cholesterol, so they can have protective effects in terms of heart disease, which is important around the menopause.

At the moment there are more than 4000 articles about phytoestrogens being published every year. One 1998 study published in Obstetrics and Gynaecology looked at the effects of Soya capsules against a placebo (dummy tablets given to part of the group). Within four weeks there was a significant reduction in hot flushes in women taking Soya

Whewf! I’ve gotta tell ya Joel, I took one look at the email that came about this blog post and my jaw hit the floor. I thought – What the heck? How could he possibly say that soy is GOOD for belly fat loss? Who stole Joel?!
Glad it was a teaser :)
My youngest son is 9 years old and I can tell when I go to his class functions which children were fed soy formula as babies and which weren’t. In fact, the difference is ENORMOUS. There are 2 girls in his class who were fed soy formula from birth, the rest were not. The 2 girls look like they are at least 15, well into puberty, the rest of the girls in his class look like regular little 9 year old girls who haven’t even glimpsed puberty yet.
What kind of health issues are these poor kids going to have as they get older? What kind of emotional issues are those poor girls going to have to deal with living as children in the bodies of young women? How is a body that grew and matured far faster than it was ever intended to going to fare into adulthood? It’s so sad and so hard to talk to the moms who realize NOW what feeding something to their babies that they thought was a good thing has done (both moms are now aware of the dangers of soy products – too little too late).
It angers me to think of all of the parents out there struggling to do what is best for their children only to find out they’ve been duped into causing them potential harm.
Keep up the good work Joel!

@ dylan:
Hey Dylan, it’s interested but most westerns (North Americans) are allergic to milk, wheat, and soy. But their are plenty of alternatives. You can always replace cow’s milk with nut milks, coconut milk, or rice milk and they all taste delicious.

As far bread, if you go to places like Trader Joes or Whole Foods they sell bread that doesn’t have any wheat, gluten, HFCS or any of those other crap ingredients they like to add to our food.

I hope that helped.

Eat Well,

James

I recall reading also that the estrogen-like compounds in soya decrease testosterone levels in men – a double whammy in that testosterone is such an anabolic (fat burning) hormone.

I am an older guy so naturally testosterone levels are reducing – I stay as far from any soya product as I can.

You scared me first! When I’ve seen email I thought you are insane, but was so curious what you camw up with, so I’m glad of my curiosity because I know now, you’re fine :)

Isn’t there a benefit though for FERMENTED soy versus non fermented? I seem to recall reading that the fermentation process helps break down those isoflavones or something like that. Can anyone clear up the difference in quality between fermented soy and non?

also @shira – Cow’s milk being unhealthy for most adults is a result of the feeding, breeding, and raising of the cows. Also the pasteurization process kills some of the helpful bacteria naturally found in milk. The lack of these bacteria MAY be the cause of intolerance in so many people.

Just a nugget of info I’ve picked up from following either Mike or Isabel… or both.

@ dylan:
I am lactose and gluten intolerant and avoid soy like the plague, as Joel said. (Read Dr. Mercola on soy).
I use cold processed whey protein made from raw organic milk. Some brands (Isagenix JayRobb) have very little or no lactose. You can also add some lactaid.
JayRobb has an eggwhite protein powder, but it is healthier to eat whole eggs.
I also use coconut products, including organic coconut oil, coconut flour for baking and coconut sugar. Tropical Traditions is a good source on the net.
Invest in good probiotics and take some psylium to support the gut. You may find your intolerances easing off that way.

Greetings Joel,

Another thought provoking article, a couple of years ago I used to consume quite a large amount of soy based products in the mistaken belief that they were healthy. I was even advised to use soy/soya by a nutritionist. It was only when I came across an article in M%$s H*£&th magazine(product placement sorry) which basically warned men against the over consumption of soy as it promotes the female hormone estrogen which in turn promotes fat storage and can lead to the development of the dreaded man-boobs that I wised-up.

To paraphrase the adage alittle bit of the wrong knowledge can be a dangerous thing, even from the well intentioned.

Regards
Michael

ps I’m still fighting the good fight against man-boobs.

Regarding shira’s comment – why would cow’s milk be bad for adults? I would think it would be a good source of calcium especially for women – and there are a lot of people who will drink skim milk and make healthy milkshakes before they will touch cheese.

Okay. Soy is bad. Gluten is bad. Milk is bad. Once you realize that, your life will change completely. You won’t feel bloated anymore, you won’t be tired after eating and you’ll feel… alive. Have you ever heard about an animal who drinks milk after childhood? No? I hope so since no animal does that. It’s illogical. I don’t even understand why we started drinking milk in the first place! For calcium? Artichokes, asparguses, bamboo shoots, beans, collards, etc. contain a lot of calcium. As for gluten, if it was that good, it would not cause your immune system to create antibodies to attack its components (mainly gliadin) and, on a long term, hurt you. Finally, soy has components that prevent proper protein digestion, that are a nuisance to the thyroid, that stop the good absorption of minerals and increase the estrogen hormone.

And sadly enough, those three bastards can be found in pretty much everything you find at the grocery store.

However, I’m happy to say that there are more and more gluten, casein (a protein of milk and cheese), lactose and soy free foods you can buy. I, for instance, only drink almond milk (which is really good!), and eat rice cereals, gluten free bread, lactose free cheese (with moderation, since it still contains casein) etc.

Anyways, good article. :)

I’ve been following the soy controversy for quite a while now. So here is my issue and questions. There is a small segment of people out here that soy seems to help with weight loss and without the development of cancer, at least in the folks I know that use it. The people are post-menapausal women. I have sopped using soy milk on the advice of many sport fitness folks and as it is, for the most part a GMO, although there is natural soy available, My weight loss has stopped completely about three weeks after I stopped my consumption and I have actually put on a couple of pounds. Our bodies are completely different and do not respond to 90% of the health data provided by sports nutritionists. Are there any weight loss gurus who have tapped into the complete chemical changes of the bodies of post menopausal woman and how leptin, insulin, glycogen synthesis, decreased estrogen, non-existent progesterone etc., affects weight loss and that added belly fat that comes with those changes? Anybody?

I am shocked! does my daily soy milk shake contribute to my belly fat? I find that I am losing fat everywhere but below the navel!
Joel, do you have any idea how many dieteticians recommend soy to pre-menopausal women? I did not have a belly when I began drinking soy milk five years ago (and eating those bland soy nuts and tofu)…. luckily, I have so far escaped the family fate of breast cancer!
The carton of organic soy milk in my fridge is going into the trash today!

My doctor has told me to stay away from soy because of the estrogen like effects. I used to have a protein drink that I liked but had to switch about five or six years ago to whey. It’s interesting that a lot of the dietitians I have talked to about my being a vegetarian tell me to drink soy protein.

Great article. I’ve been reading more about soy. Unfortunately I used a Soy protien drink instead of my regular brand. Been exercising/working out like regular and suddenly a weight gain over 2 weeks…damn no wonder why I felt bloated. Thanks for shedding light on the subject. It is amazing though the articles out there saying how great it is for ya. Again thanks. I guess I have to do another phase of your XFLD…lol

Good catch Joel.

It is quite sad, how many people are miss-lead out there whether it comes to building muscle or losing fat. No wonder so many people just end up giving up, they get too confused with the next ‘fad diet’ or next magic pill.

I TOTALLY agree Joel. Soy is also one of the most GMO’d foods around..how can that be good for you? In my opinion, any soy product other than tempeh and miso is bad news and should be avoided completely. Thanks for the informative info. More need to hear this!!!

@ dylan:
Try almond or brown rice milk………unsweetened. :)

Interesting post Joel. I too am confused about the soy “dilemma”. I know soy increases estrogen levels but are organic soy just as detrimental? How do you account for the Japanese and other Asian cultures who live many healthy years with a diet dominant in soy products? The research I’ve read have shown Asian women to have the lowest rates of breast cancer…perhaps genetics have a large role in this as well?

Ah! I have heard many times how bad soy is for you, but I’m vegan so I do tend to eat quite a bit of soy… (soy milk, tofu, edamame, etc…) Does anyone know of any good substitute?? :(

Flo

Joel,
I think you may need to expand on this blog! My daughter, 12, does not drink milk and loves soy milk! I have not seen an increase in her weight and/or belly fat…. Is this a problem for the “older” folk than the younger ones?

I also think, we can find other calcium sources than milk! What other mammal drinks the milk of another mammal?

@ David:
I hear that there are two types of SOY. The fermented and the unfermented versions. I also hear that Asians and other people outside of the U.S. generally have access to the fermented soy (properly processed and aged), a healthier version. Thus I can understand why those bodies are leaner and healthier besides the fact that a healthy as you can eat diet and genetics does a world of good as well. Personally I see no need to invest my money on unfermented soy when it’s used as a preservative in most processed foods anyway. It’s probably in the animal feed also.

It is a jacked up world when people write an article for entertainment and don’t do their research. Weight loss myths and everyone loves to talk about them.

thank you! I’m vegetarian and have been telling other vegetarians this for ages and no one wants to believe me! I have now just sent a load of people links to this page and posted a link from Facebook profile!

Amen!!

good post. soy is way overproduced, and then touted as a health product, so consumers overpay for it (unlike corn, which is overproduced, and dirt cheap.) not only is soy bad for you (particularly for boys) it (like corn , wheat etc) it is geneticaly modified, which then produces a whole host of other problems.

if one must have milk, goat’s is healthier, although it tates a bit grassy.

As a vegetarian i tend to eat a lot of soy.What would you suggest for my protein?